* Kosher / Halal *

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Ashii

Age: 121
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SD, DL, Z
aur baki sab bhi plzzz


foran answer chaiye
kya hum Kosher kha sakte hein


if u say k majboori mei kha sakte hein ton wot do u call majboori ??





leave this topic here plz,,, religion mei ki answer karta hi nahi hai
Posted 12 Jun 2005

yes according to my knowledge, there is no problem to eat kosher.

forbidden is, jiss par Allah ke siwa kissi aur ka naam liya gya ho, that means, ke koi bali ya qurbani ka gosht jo kissi devta ya nakhuda ke naam par qurban kiya gya ho.

yeh nahi kaha gya kay halal janwaroN me se woh gosht na khao, jiss par Allah ka naam na liya gya ho. Allah ka naam aap le kar kha lo.

for this opinion i have some strong ahadees from bukhari, too. i will give u references as sonn as i get near to my books.



Please read this note about my opinion
Posted 12 Jun 2005

Ashii says
mera apna khyal bhi yehi tha
but obviously mera khyal shareeat nahi hai




important baat Khuda ka naam lena (jo k jews aur hamara aik hi hai) aur zibah karna hai
thnxxxxxxx DL
im waiting for ref
Posted 12 Jun 2005

Bazigaar says
wut's kosher?
Posted 12 Jun 2005

Badal says
Bazigaar said:

wut's kosher?


Kosher means 'fit, or proper for use' according to Jewish laws, just as Halal means 'fit, or proper for use' according to Islamic laws.

Posted 12 Jun 2005

Badal says
Djeedja Shareef said:

yeh nahi kaha gya kay halal janwaroN me se woh gosht na khao, jiss par Allah ka naam na liya gya ho. Allah ka naam aap le kar kha lo.



"Eat not (of meats) on which Allah's name has not been pronounced..." (Quran 6:121).
Posted 12 Jun 2005

Bazigaar says
lol..yaar jab hum mcdonald mae khana kha lete hian to pata nahi kya gand bala hota hae to phir kya halal to kya haram as long as it;s not pork...all is good
Posted 13 Jun 2005

Bazigaar said:

lol..yaar jab hum mcdonald mae khana kha lete hian to pata nahi kya gand bala hota hae to phir kya halal to kya haram as long as it;s not pork...all is good



you got 2 things halal in mcdonalds

1.patat
2.fish burger

Posted 13 Jun 2005

Ashii says
Badal said:

Djeedja Shareef said:

yeh nahi kaha gya kay halal janwaroN me se woh gosht na khao, jiss par Allah ka naam na liya gya ho. Allah ka naam aap le kar kha lo.



"Eat not (of meats) on which Allah's name has not been pronounced..." (Quran 6:121).

dono ki baat samajh nahi i

explain Z

DL,,, Allah ka naam le kar kha lo se kya matlab ??
halal gosht na ho aur Allah ka naa le k kha lo ????????
Posted 13 Jun 2005

Ashii says
Bazigaar said:

lol..yaar jab hum mcdonald mae khana kha lete hian to pata nahi kya gand bala hota hae to phir kya halal to kya haram as long as it;s not pork...all is good


i dont,,,
tabhi to pucha hai


mc donald ka to fish burger bhi nahi khati me
errrrr,,,
pata nahi kya kuch chamicals milae hote hein
asli kuch to hota hi nahi
Posted 13 Jun 2005

but zibah karte waqt agar ALLAH U AKBAR na parha jaye..phir tu halal na hua
Posted 13 Jun 2005

Ashii says
cant say anything...........


wot do u think,, muslim buchers sara din ALLAH HU AKBAR ki gardaan karte rehte hein
Posted 13 Jun 2005

macmenu main bhi pork hota hai
Posted 13 Jun 2005

SALL said:

cant say anything...........


wot do u think,, muslim buchers sara din ALLAH HU AKBAR ki gardaan karte rehte hein



zibah karne se pehle..
Posted 13 Jun 2005

Ashii says
arey to yehi to keh rhai hu naaa
din mei kitne so janwar zibah hote hein

to kya harr aik ko zibah karne se pehle Allah hu Akbar kehte hein woh
Posted 13 Jun 2005

@badal

thanks a lot yaar for this correction. this ayet was not in my mind at that time. buhat buhat shukria.

@sall

well i meant, the meat of that animals, which are allowed, is allowed to eat, if it is made for the purpose of eating. if no name is pronounced, that doesnt mean that u cant pronounce the name of Allah on it. some muslims say ke zibah karte waqt name lena zaroori hai. but in the opinion of some others(e.g.Al-Azhar Kairo University) and in my opinion, too, u could pronounce Allahs name as soon as u get the meat in ur plate.
jiss par Allah ka naam nahi liya hota, uss par khud liya jasakta hai, iss ki shart yehi hai ke gosht khanay ke liye ho na ke kissi aur purpose ke liye, other purpose is e.g. siraf shauqia hi kissi ne shikaar kiya ho aur khaanay ki niyyat na ho.

its the same, as u may eat the meat of animals which ur dogs catch for u. ab dogs kya Allah ka naam lete haiN? but unn ko sikhaya hota hai aur animals ko pakarrne ki niyyat yeh hoti hai ke insan uss gosht ko khaye. to jabb animals ka pakkra hua gosht allow hai to woh gosht, jo ke bana hi khaanay ke liye ho , woh kioN mana hona chahiye? doosra gosht woh mana hai, jiss par Allah ke siwa kissi ka naam liya gya ho, as i said over.

but in this case, i think, this ayet is more precise than the discussion about halal and haram

[5:6] This day all good things have been made lawful for you. And the food of the people of the Book is lawful for you. And your food is lawful for them. And lawful for you are chaste believing women and chaste women from among those who were given the Book before you, when you give them their dowries, contracting valid marriage and not committing fornication, nor taking secret paramours. And whoever rejects the faith, his work indeed is vain, and in the Hereafter he will be among the losers.


Please read this note about my opinion
Posted 13 Jun 2005

Badal says
Djeedja Shareef said:

but in this case, i think, this ayet is more precise than the discussion about halal and haram

[5:6] This day all good things have been made lawful for you. And the food of the people of the Book is lawful for you. And your food is lawful for them. And lawful for you are chaste believing women and chaste women from among those who were given the Book before you, when you give them their dowries, contracting valid marriage and not committing fornication, nor taking secret paramours. And whoever rejects the faith, his work indeed is vain, and in the Hereafter he will be among the losers.



this ayat is [5:5], not [5:6]

We may eat with them and they with us. But this general proclamation of permission is preceded by a reiteration of the statement: 'All good things (tayyebaat) have been made lawful to you.' This indicates that if the People of the Book either do not observe those principles of cleanliness and purity which are considered obligatory by the Law or if their food includes prohibited items, then one should abstain from eating them.

If, for instance, they either slaughter an animal without pronouncing the name of God or if they slaughter it in the name of anyone else but God it is not lawful for us to eat that animal.

Likewise, if intoxicating drinks, the flesh of swine, and any other prohibited thing is found on their dining table we may not justify our partaking of such items on the ground that the persons concerned are People of the Book.
Posted 14 Jun 2005

Bazigaar says
SALL said:

Bazigaar said:

lol..yaar jab hum mcdonald mae khana kha lete hian to pata nahi kya gand bala hota hae to phir kya halal to kya haram as long as it;s not pork...all is good


i dont,,,
tabhi to pucha hai


mc donald ka to fish burger bhi nahi khati me
errrrr,,,
pata nahi kya kuch chamicals milae hote hein
asli kuch to hota hi nahi


well, other then potk, i eat all @ mcdonalds..fish, beef, chicken...all is good...bismillah parh ke kha liya...agaay jahanum mae to jana he hae
Posted 14 Jun 2005

Ashii says
DL aur Z ka post baat mei parh lu gi
but DL,, u said Allah ka naam le k kha lo
par zabeeha hona bhi to aik shart hai
??


bazu najoomi,,
aap ko sab pata hai,,, sab ki tarha intzar hi karo ge ya futur change karna chaho ge
Posted 14 Jun 2005

cutefriend says
shahrukh khan said:

Bazigaar said:

lol..yaar jab hum mcdonald mae khana kha lete hian to pata nahi kya gand bala hota hae to phir kya halal to kya haram as long as it;s not pork...all is good



you got 2 things halal in mcdonalds

1.patat
2.fish burger



yeh rite
Posted 14 Jun 2005

@badal

actually u are right. but kosher means for me that they pronounced the name of GOD on it, otherwise its not kosher for them, too.
some autors dont count bismillah as an ayet, thats why u think, it was 5:5. i count bismillah as an ayet of every soorat, thats why for me it was 5:6.

@sall

tell me one thing. jabb koi sidhaya hua janwar kissi parinday ya khargosh ka shikar karta hai to how many times uss shikaar kiye hue janwar ko zibah kiya jata hai? woh chotte chotte pidde pidde se janwar to dog ke muNh me hi marr jate haiN mostly.
and were u ever been in a big factory for meat? i think u should be there. agar har janwar ko kuch konservative opinions ke tehet zibah kiya jaaye to i dont think ke woh factory ko business me koi faeda hoga. well waisay abhi aap samjheN ya na samjheN, jabb main sihah-sittah kay hawalay de dunga to i hope ke phir samajh aajayegi. insahallah


Please read this note about my opinion
Posted 14 Jun 2005

Bazigaar says
SALL said:


bazu najoomi,,
aap ko sab pata hai,,, sab ki tarha intzar hi karo ge ya futur change karna chaho ge



i don;t like changes...especially when i have to bring them myself
Posted 14 Jun 2005

Kosher is money making business for Rabis. They are cashing in on religious restrictions in their religion.

Not all kosher is permissible as wine and liquor are permissible for consumption among Jews.

I agree with DL as many learned scholars have agreed to that theory. I take extra caustion in food matters because all westerners are not people of the book as many among them are atheists. So its better to consume that is pure. Allah swt has given us the best practise but has also allowed other options which may not be the best for us.

More importantly, it is the source of income with which you by your food. If it is not 100% halal, no matter what you buy with it is not halal either.
Posted 15 Jun 2005

Ashii says
abhi i only read SD s post
baki baad mei

SD SD SD SD SD
yeh sab mujhe pata hai,, i was asking abt MEAT
and obviously agar me jews se lu gi to i ll b vv careful k sahi waale hon

baki halal haram to doosre topic mei discuss ho raha hai na



DL
yar mujhe iss baare mei kuch bhi nahi pata,, me ne shikar ki hui koi cheez kabhi khai hi nahi
balke me ne to aaj tak koi asli ka shikari tak nahi dekha
Posted 15 Jun 2005

What I meant to say Sall, Taqwa is the center piece of all actions. According to hanafi school of thought, buthers who don't offer 5 daily prayers, animals they slaughter are not halal for Muslims to consume. What about consumers who don't pray but consume so called "Halal" meat, is that food halal? Actually, people of the past did not eat from the food of people who didn't establish prayers in their life.

Allah SWT allowed us the food of the people of the book. It definitly has to be "Tayyab" that is clean and pure and have no trace of haram added to it. It does not mean it has to be zabiha. As DL et al mentioned earlier, when any animal or even other items of consumption are given in the name of one other than Allah are neither halal nor Tayyab.

Bottom line: Kosher or not kosher, if food is clean and free of shirk, there is no harm in consuming it when you are sure its from the people of the book. Yet, it should not be given preference over properly halal meat when it is available.

Allah knows the best. If you can find a better opinion from other learned persons with proper references from Quran and Hadith, take that opinion and throw my views aside.
Posted 15 Jun 2005

Ashii says
kanfuuuuze



matlab k zabeeha hona zaroori nahi hai
yarrr sahi sahi btao warna aap sab ko gunah mile ga


aap ka matlab hai k hum yeh sab rest wagera mei kha sakte hein,,, agar ehl e kitab ka hai to
????



""it should not be given preference over properly halal meat when it is available""
yarr simple baat,, proper halal meat is available, but pb yeh hai k musalmano ka gosht halal to shayad ho par usse kha k bande ka khana haram ho jata hai
sorry to say but mostly muslim buchers r dirty,,
dirty shops,, non professional butchers,, aur meat ki shakal and taste,, ufffffff
Posted 15 Jun 2005

To my understanding it is permissible if you are sure one who killed the animal is from the people of the book and it has not been mixed with any haram item. As i said earlier, its an option but preference is for meat provided by a good Muslim.

Unfortunately, Muslim's story is same around the globe - filthy, dirty, and stinky. Followers of religion where cleanliness is part of faith - what a shame
Posted 16 Jun 2005

Ashii says
hmm wohi to
matlab yeh nahi k baki sab log are vvv clean,, par yar muslims shd not b like others

upper se tameez bhi nahi hoti kissi kaam ki




hey one thing
i ve heard k shikar kiye hue janwar ko marne se pehel churi pher lete hein k woh 'zibah' ho jae
otherwise woh murdar hota hai,, yani haram

and wot abt machines
machine bhi ehl e kitab hoti hai kya
Posted 16 Jun 2005

What about knife

its a tool silly
Posted 17 Jun 2005

Ashii says
opppsss,,
rite



hey i forgot to post something last night
agar zabeeha zaroori nahi to,, ,tooooooooo to,,
y do we say only fish ko halal karna zaroori nahi hota

wot doest it mean,, han



plz plz dont take me wrong
baal ki khaal nahi nikal rahe hum,,, just want to b sure,,,,,,
Posted 17 Jun 2005

hmm to understand this matter of shikaar, u should be once with a shikari, too. there are more situations where the animals die before shikari reaches them. and that they are murdaar then, its new to me.

fish ko halal karna zaroori nahi hota, means ke haraam khai jaasakti hai? heheh the problem is
muslim tareeq ka zabeeha is halal,
but not all of halal is zabeeha.
zabeeha doesnt mean halal. zabeeha is a practice.

fact is an exception although it ends. yani problem fish ke muamlay me yeh hoti ke murdaar hoti na keh zabah na hoti. i think.
Posted 17 Jun 2005

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