Bismillah it: The Halal Meat Dilemma

Badal:

that was not the reason of its being halal shahrukh

aur alchohol kabhi halal thi bhi nahi, islam nay kabhi isay halal nahi kaha, can you show a single verse jis main likha ho kay yeh HALAL hai? ofcourse is kay haram honay kay baray main koi hukam nahi aya tha thats why it was considered halal, aur ahista ahista ppl ko samjhanay kay baad kay yeh aik burai hai isay bilkul haram karar diya gya. i think you got it

yaar alcohal was allowed in beginng of islam..dat's what i am sayingBazigaar38485.991412037

Posted on 5/13/2005 10:00:10 PM

djeedja lotta

Badal:
can you show a single verse jis main likha ho kay yeh HALAL hai?

hahah badal kya baat ki hai, jahalat wali.
just one chalange from me, too.

can u show me just one verse, where alkohol ko "haram" kaha ho? there isent any such verse. dhoond lo jakar. mujhe bhi dikhana. siraf ratte lagaye hue hain, sahibaan ne.

Posted on 5/13/2005 11:41:08 PM

djeedja lotta:

hahah badal kya baat ki hai, jahalat wali.
just one chalange from me, too.

can u show me just one verse, where alkohol ko "haram" kaha ho? there isent any such verse. dhoond lo jakar. mujhe bhi dikhana. siraf ratte lagaye hue hain, sahibaan ne.

i don't think if i recall any verse either....but ahmadis believe sharabn to be haram if i am not mistaken...rite?

Posted on 5/13/2005 11:48:36 PM

djeedja lotta

@baazigar

of course its not allowed. ahmadiyyat ko idher kioN ghussa liya hai yaar.

main ne to mr. badal sahib ki lafz pakarrne wali adat ko tiss miss karne ki koshish ki thi, jiss tarah woh aik lafaz "halal" ko pakarr ke baith gaye main ne pooch liya ke "haram" kahaN likha hai bhala sharab ke baare me. likha hai kya?

iss ka matlab ayinda se mr d.l. kp muhtaat hona hoga, kuch bhi log ahmadiya muslim jamaat ki taraf mansoob kar sakte hain. khair i will take care. inshallah

djeedja lotta38485.9988888889

Posted on 5/13/2005 11:56:39 PM

djeedja lotta:
iss ka matlab ayinda se mr d.l. kp muhtaat hona hoga, kuch bhi log ahmadiya muslim jamaat ki taraf mansoob kar sakte hain. khair i will take care. inshallah

i mentioend u;t jamat cuz i know they consider sharab haram too, but the way u were talking...others could have taken u wrong way and thought k maybe u'r jamat allows sharab..dat's why i said it...

i do know that halal/haram is all same in u;r jamat and any other muslim...no difference there..i think

Posted on 5/14/2005 1:44:46 AM

djeedja lotta:

Badal:
can you show a single verse jis main likha ho kay yeh HALAL hai?

hahah badal kya baat ki hai, jahalat wali.
just one chalange from me, too.

can u show me just one verse, where alkohol ko "haram" kaha ho? there isent any such verse. dhoond lo jakar. mujhe bhi dikhana. siraf ratte lagaye hue hain, sahibaan ne.

djeedja lotta:
main ne to mr. badal sahib ki lafz pakarrne wali adat ko tiss miss karne ki koshish ki thi, jiss tarah woh aik lafaz "halal" ko pakarr ke baith gaye main ne pooch liya ke "haram" kahaN likha hai bhala sharab ke baare me. likha hai kya?

first of all no one is going to challenge anyone here, and secondly, be careful of using such words like 'jahalat' for anyone here, and NO TANZ in anyway, no one is going to be perfect, i hope you got it.

back to the topic. main nay koi lafz nahi pakra hai, halal ko kahan pakra main nay? aur kia ghalat kaha halal kay baray main? aur main nay just traditional way main baat kar di thi. Islam main KHAMR haram hai, that is, anything that intoxicates the mind, aur alchohol (i know its scientific word only) jahaan drink kay tor par use hoti hai KHAMR ki definition main hi aati hai.

aur sharab (where i used it?

, anyways

) bhi traditional meanings main (both in urdu and english, drink) aisay liquid kay liye use hota hai jis say intoxication hoti hai, i know arabic main aisay use nahi hota. agar aap aisay use nahi kartay hain tu aur baat hai. now words tu aap pakar rahay hain 'alchohol' , 'sharab' etc.

and stick to the spirit of the topic not words

Posted on 5/14/2005 2:45:35 PM

Badal:

first of all no one is going to challenge anyone here, and secondly, be careful of using such words like 'jahalat' for anyone here, and NO TANZ in anyway, no one is going to be perfect, i hope you got it.

Language should be used carefully while posting no matter u agree with anyone or not

Posted on 5/14/2005 3:08:25 PM

Ashii

Quran pak mei alcohol haram nahi napasandida hai,,, ya kuch aisa hi,, mana alcohol nahi nasha hai

haraam isse Hazrat Umer (ra) ne karar diya,, i agree to ather, coz unhon ne namaz parhne mei galti ki thi nashe mei

i ve read somewhere,, peena nahi behekna haram hai,, (sach hai ya nahi i cant say anything)
par agar behekne se maksad nahi to peena ki zaroorat hi kya hai,, its something bad for health everyone know it

Posted on 5/14/2005 3:48:04 PM

Ashii

hmm,, mera khyal jaise choti umer mei hum log cigrettes peene ko style samajhte hein,, and most us start it sirf ishhhtyle marne liye (including myself)
sharab k saath bhi aisa hi chakkar hai

pork khane mei koi stylish baat nazar nahi aati shayad issi liye jaan bakhsh di hum ne uss ki

Posted on 5/14/2005 3:49:48 PM

SALL:
Quran pak mei alcohol haram nahi napasandida hai,,, ya kuch aisa hi,, mana alcohol nahi nasha hai

haraam isse Hazrat Umer (ra) ne karar diya,, i agree to ather, coz unhon ne namaz parhne mei galti ki thi nashe mei

i ve read somewhere,, peena nahi behekna haram hai,, (sach hai ya nahi i cant say anything)
par agar behekne se maksad nahi to peena ki zaroorat hi kya hai,, its something bad for health everyone know it

i dont agree.

"Quran pak mei alcohol haram nahi napasandida hai", Quran Pak main tu alchohol ka zikar hi nahi hai, its KHAMR only that is haram and anything that intoxicates the mind is KHAMR (alchohol, opium, heroin etc).

aur behakna tu sirf use karnay ka result hai, and there are many other harms in it too, aur haram wo hai who causes these harms.

Posted on 5/14/2005 4:38:09 PM

SALL:

haraam isse Hazrat Umer (ra) ne karar diya,,

in dat case, alcohal is not haram cuz hazrat umar (RA) had no right to add/delete anything that was finalized by holy prophet (PBUH)...and if quran ne sharab ko na pasandeeda karar diya hae then it's not haram...such as divorce..which is also na-pasandeeda act...but it is after all..halal

wow..this means booze party tonite...

go go go..shorty..it;s u;r bday

anyhow..i still think sharab is haram...i'll do some research on it and come back to u guys...how it says sharab to be haram

Bazigaar38486.9662268519

Posted on 5/14/2005 11:10:09 PM

naah...it;s definatly haram...it wasn't in the begining of islam, but then soon it was labeled haram...and i am sure i will find somehting where it says it is haram (dat's when i get home and do some research)

Posted on 5/15/2005 12:02:46 AM

Ashii

yarr listen,,
im not a scholar but phir bhi jo baat parhi ya (reliable) srce se pata chalti hai i share it here,,,

hazrat umer wala wakeya to bohot se log jante hein,,, mujhe herat hai yahan kissi ko nahi pata

divorce aur nashe ka masla fark hai bazu yar,, word 'napasandida' nahi use karna chaiye tha mujhe,, par khair sharab k haram hone mei mujhe koi shak nahi hai,, par jaisa pork k baare mei Quran pak mei clearly kai jaga pe haram hona likha hai i didnt find anything jo sharab ko 'haram' kehti ho,, par sab jante hein islam qura, hadees aur shariyat se mil k complete hota hai,, iss liye u better cancel ur party

Posted on 5/15/2005 1:33:37 AM

saal je...sharab holy prophet (PBUH) ke zamanay mae he mana ker de gya thee...(i will find out the reference for u)...i dunno ye hazrat umar(RA) ke baat aoo kidher se laye ho...(reference?)

Posted on 5/15/2005 2:27:37 AM

{Yaa ayyuha alladhina aamanu innama al-khamru wa al-maisiru wa al-ansaabu wa al-azlaamu rijzun min 'amali ash-shaitaani fa jtanibuhu la'allakum tuflihoon.}

{O, you who believe, intoxicants (khamr), lotteries, idols and divining arrows are nothing but filth from the work of the Shaitaan so keep away from them that perhaps you may succeed.} Al-Ma'idah:90

*************
"Kullu muskirin khamrun. Wa kullu muskirin haraamun. Wa man shariba al-khamra fiy ad-dunyaa fa maata wa huwa yudminuhaa lam yashrabhaa tiy al-aakhira."

"Every intoxicant is "wine". And every intoxicant is forbidden. Whoever drinks wine in this world and dies as a user of it will not drink it in the hereafter." Muslim & Bukhari

*************
"Laa yazniy as-zaaniy heena yazniy wa huwa mu'min. Wa laa yasriqu as-saariqu heena yasriqu wa huwa mu'min. Wa laa yashrabu al-khamra heena yashrabuhaa wa huwa mu'min."

"The fornicator does not fornicate while fornicating and he is a believer. And the thief does not steal while stealing and he is a believer. And no one drinks wine while drinking wine and he is a believer". Bukhari & Muslim

Posted on 5/15/2005 4:01:39 AM

Just wanna add some more to badal's post wid referrences so that if anyone wanna check they can check too.

All Hadiths are from Sahih Bukhari

Volume 7, Book 69, Number 481:
Narrated Ibn 'Umar:

Allah's Apostle said, "Whoever drinks alcoholic drinks in the world and does not repent (before dying), will be deprived of it in the Hereafter."

Volume 7, Book 69, Number 492a:
Narrated 'Aisha:

Allah's Apostle was asked about Al-Bit a liquor prepared from honey which the Yemenites used to drink. Allah's Apostle said, "All drinks that intoxicate are unlawful (to drink)."

Volume 7, Book 69, Number 482:
Narrated Abu Huraira:

On the night Allah's Apostle was taken on a night journey (Miraj) two cups, one containing wine and the other milk, were presented to him at Jerusalem. He looked at it and took the cup of milk. Gabriel said, "Praise be to Allah Who guided you to Al-Fitra (the right path); if you had taken (the cup of) wine, your nation would have gone astray."

Volume 7, Book 69, Number 483:
Narrated Anas:

I heard from Allah's Apostle a narration which none other than I will narrate to you. The Prophet, said, "From among the portents of the Hour are the following: General ignorance (in religious affairs) will prevail, (religious) knowledge will decrease, illegal sexual intercourse will prevail, alcoholic drinks will be drunk (in abundance), men will decrease and women will increase so much so that for every fifty women there will be one man to look after them."

Posted on 5/15/2005 4:39:51 AM

Few Hadiths from Sahih Muslim

Book 023, Number 4956:
'A'isha reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) was asked about Bit, whereupon he said: Every drink that causes intoxication is forbidden.

Book 023, Number 4959:
Abu Musa reported: Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) sent me and Mu'adh b. Jabal to Yemen. I said: Allah's Messenger, there is prepared in our land a wine out of barley which is known as Mizr (beer of our times) and a wine from honey which is known as Bit, (are these also forbidden? ), whereupon he said: Every intoxicant is forbidden.

Book 023, Number 4962:
Jabir reported that a person came from Jaishan, a town of Yemen, and he asked Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) about the wine which was drunk in their land and which was prepared from millet and was called Mizr. Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) asked whether that was intoxicating. He said: Yes. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: Every intoxicant is forbidden. Verily Allah the Exalted and Majestic, made a covenant to those who drank intoxicants to make their drink Tinat al-Khabal. They said: Allah's Messenger, what is Tinat a]-Khabal? He said: It is the sweat of the denizens of Hell or the discharge of the denizens of Hell.

Book 023, Number 4963:
Ibn 'Umar reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Every intoxicant is Khamr and every intoxicant is forbidden. He who drinks wine in this world and dies while he is addicted to it, not having repented, will not be given a drink in the Hereafter.

Posted on 5/15/2005 5:12:14 AM

so this was all bout wine...how bout beer?

Posted on 5/15/2005 6:42:48 AM

Bazigaar:
so this was all bout wine...how bout beer?

I think you mean non-alchoholic beer, that is claimed to be alchohol free.

It was reported that the Prophet (SAW) said: "Every intoxicating substance is haram. (Narrated by al-Bukhari) And it was narrated that The Messenger of Allah (SAW) said: "Every intoxicating substance is haram, and whatever intoxicates in large amounts, a handful of it is haram." (Narrated by at-Tirmidhi). Focusing more on the question in point, that is whether a non-alcoholic Beer is haraam; Non-alcoholic beer is haram because although it is claimed that it is alcohol free, it does have some alcohol in it.

It was checked with beer manufacturers and confirmed that non-alcoholic beers do have a minimum amount of alcohol in them because during the manufacturing process, a small amount of alcohol is unavoidable. Also, the matter was checked from the legal perspective and found that U.S. law (and probably European law, too) allows beer manufacturers to claim that it is alcohol free if it contains less than one percent alcohol.

Also look at the answers.com definitions of Beer:

a. A fermented alcoholic beverage brewed from malt and flavored with hops.
b. A fermented beverage brewed by traditional methods that is then dealcoholized so that the finished product contains no more than 0.5 percent alcohol.
c. A carbonated beverage produced by a method in which the fermentation process is either circumvented or altered, resulting in a finished product having an alcohol content of no more than 0.01 percent.

Posted on 5/15/2005 9:16:39 AM

Very good info Badal

Thanx for sharing it cuz
before that i thought
non-alcoholic beer is not
haram.

Posted on 5/15/2005 9:28:37 AM

chalo yar jitnay percent bhi....i drink anyways..more then 0.5 percent..too bad i do it...i am not a saint

Posted on 5/15/2005 9:39:57 AM

DejaVu077:
Very good info Badal
Thanx for sharing it cuz
before that i thought
non-alcoholic beer is not
haram.

Asal main ppl "alchohol free", "non-alchoholic" jaisi terms say dhoka kha jatay hain. jabkay yeh prooved hai hai kay is main alchohol hoti hai.

Posted on 5/15/2005 9:40:09 AM

Bazigaar:
chalo yar jitnay percent bhi....i drink anyways..more then 0.5 percent..too bad i do it...i am not a saint

yeh halal haram saints kay liye nahi hain bas, har muslim kay liye hain, it needs only a little courage to abstain from it

Posted on 5/15/2005 9:43:36 AM

Badal:

Bazigaar:
chalo yar jitnay percent bhi....i drink anyways..more then 0.5 percent..too bad i do it...i am not a saint

yeh halal haram saints kay liye nahi hain bas, har muslim kay liye hain, it needs only a little courage to abstain from it

courage to hae...per gham bhi hae

Posted on 5/15/2005 9:52:31 AM

Badal:

Asal main ppl "alchohol free", "non-alchoholic" jaisi terms say dhoka kha jatay hain. jabkay yeh prooved hai hai kay is main alchohol hoti hai.

mae alcohal..meaning asli wali ke baray mae he baat ker raha thaa

Posted on 5/15/2005 9:53:24 AM